Mare counts down from 8

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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Subverted DietDoc » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:21 pm

The best mood stabilizer and antidepressant I’ve ever taken is buprenorphine. No question about it...it’s a uber potent feel-good drug...until it’s not. All drugs have negitive effects, especially over time. As your plasma levels lower there’s inevitable mood changes, and they come and go. But clearly all things are temporarily until you jump. You’re on the taper rollercoaster and you’ve gone fast.

I started my thread when I got to 1 mg a day. That was November 2016...1 mg...I jumped February 5, 2018...16 months to taper off a single milligram! You’ve gone down 7 mg in two months! Granted our age difference is 2X + Y but still maybe it’s slow-n-low time. I think methadone may be a bit more harsh to get off of physically but I am convinced buprenorphine has to produce the most profound psychic effects.

Are you going to change to a liquid method? 8s are hard to make low doses with.

Baby Beluga.
I have two wolves fighting in my heart. One wolf is a vengeful, angry one. The other wolf is a loving, compassionate one. Which wolf will win the fight in my heart? The one I feed.

Buprenorphine: 10 years @ 16 mg/d ave. - Jumped Off February 5, 2018 @ 0.09mg
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Sub4Sevenyrs » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:55 am

cheeps wrote:
Sub4Sevenyrs wrote:The anger is pretty much gone, I'm an aggressive person by nature but been pretty calm lately. It comes from an upbringing in competitive sports, the only time it's acceptable to let it all fly. Anxiety is pretty good too, not gone though. But yea my anger can light a fire, great when it's focused, not so much when it's not.



That's good to hear....curious to know what sports and positions you liked to play?


Start with baseball (centerfield), football (running back) then hockey (defense). I used to love flying around at 25 mph, getting low and smashing someone on open ice. I'm not a big guy but I was solid so that's really why it was so much fun, I could use my speed to get momentum and BOOOOM, you can feel every cell in your body stretching as it braces for the impact then recoiling yet no pain at all, just like an explosion. Messed around with friends playing handball, basketball, golf, bowling. Favorites are hockey and handball, by far. Growing up in the city I could go to a local park at any time and get a handball game in the summer with random people, not so much out in the woods.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Sub4Sevenyrs » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:56 am

How's it going over there MARE?
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Mare » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:44 am

Wow. I lost my post for the third time. Can't do it again now. I'll try again later. Thanks guys. I'm alive. Just blank.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Mare » Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:49 am

SDD: yes, I plan to switch to a liquid dose once I get under 1mg daily. At this point I'm still pretty confident in cutting the strips down to .5mg. It gets tricky around .25. I have a special craft knife I use solely for cutting my strips and I get a pretty clean line. Absolutely, bupe has very intense psychic effects as you put it. Hard to break!


As far as an update goes, I have little to report. I've Ben feeling super blank lately. Just no real emotion. I wake up and just kind of open my eyes and blink. I'm not happy, I'm not sad, I just am. I haven't got much energy, and my appetite seems to be diminishing.

It's been about a month and I'm not really seeing any changes. My legs ache a lot of the time. I just scrubbed my boyfriend's tub out, it took 2 hours or more. There was some kind of blackish greyish residue coating it. I got it white, but fuck that was arduous. I haven't taken a bath in years but I got some mentholated Epsom salts and I'm having a soak and a glass of wine while he plays video games.

I'm not sure what I should do, how to proceed. I'd like to get back on with it, so I at least have some kind of relativity. It was easier to deal with the symptoms with a clear endgame. Now I feel like I'm just floating here with no goal. I don't know that it will get any easier, as I've put my taper on hold for about a month now with no obvious benefit. I'll think more about it tomorrow.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby nomojo3479 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:15 am

Hey Mare, I been following along.. my two cents, My taper was much slower than urs but just as a data point.. I was able to get so I was feeling pretty stable/good @ 1.25...I did take some time at that dosage (mayb too much idk). Sub is a really creepy drug, it unwinds slowww.. I def get the weariness with the tapering process. Anyway great job so far, keep it up
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Subverted DietDoc » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:44 am

Hey Mare...Glad to see you posting. Today is day 18 for me...sub free after 10 years. I’m 57 years old and had been on and off the strongest pharmaceutical opiates made. Including drugs that can’t even be prescribed, only administered...meaning seriously intense shit. I always got myself off of all of it, never been to a rehab once. But the last time I just suffered and there was this new drug called suboxone that had recently hit the market. Well, you get it. What I’m saying is, I’m much older and had acess to insane drugs and used them for more years then you’ve been alive...then went on 10 years of suboxone...then got off that.

Not to in any way diminish your pain, but if I’m still alive after all that and opiate free, you got this.

What dose are you at...1.25mg/d?

Everyone has their take on what’s useful advice but IMHO just multiply your current dose by .85 and keep doing that down to .1-ish mg. That’s a taper chart with 15% reductions per dose. It will give you a good perspective of what a mid-level gradual taper would look like. Maybe take each dose for 10 days, a week, two weeks, whatever feels right for you. But you’ll have a map at least. Premaking my pieces helped a lot, but you’re switching to the Mouthwash Method so it matter less once you do that.

I can tell you that weird things happen, like I felt better at .8mg than I did at 1.3mg...sometimes I’d feel a drop on day 3, sometimes day 7, and sometime not at all.

The only universal truth is if you want to get it done you have to push yourself sometimes. Embrace the suck kind of thing. At the end, I did 5 drops at only 5 days of each drop, becasue I couldn’t take anymore.

On a lighter note...I bindged watched Altered Carbon during my first jump week and loved it. SYFY distopia future crime mystery thing...liked it a lot.
I have two wolves fighting in my heart. One wolf is a vengeful, angry one. The other wolf is a loving, compassionate one. Which wolf will win the fight in my heart? The one I feed.

Buprenorphine: 10 years @ 16 mg/d ave. - Jumped Off February 5, 2018 @ 0.09mg
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby CatsMeow » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:50 pm

Hi Mare! So glad to hear from you. I'm sorry you're feeling blah. I think taking a month at 1.25 is the best thing for you to do right now. Let your body & your mind catch up a bit. You dropped so much so quickly (in the scheme of things).

It's all going to be okay. One day (and I hope it's soon) you should be feeling okay at 1.25. These things just take more time than we hope for some times. When I drop, I never know what to expect either.

I hope your Epsom salt bath makes your body feel much better. Then hopefully your mind will follow too.

We're all rooting for you Mare. We do care!
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Mare » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:10 pm

Thanks for all the support everyone, I was up too late last night (reading Altered Carbon because I'm so in love with it, SDD) and I woke up 4 hours past my dose time so I feel like garbage. Just had to pop in and say...

I SNEEZED! TWICE! IT WAS GLORIOUS!!!
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Mare » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:22 pm

I've read everyone's responses and I'm glad to see all the support. Thanks mojo and add and cat. I'm trying here. I think maybe I'm just not doing enough with my hours being cut. I'm on a weird work week where I'm only scheduled last Saturday and this Saturday, so I'm in the middle of a 6 day break. Watched all of the Harry Potter movies. Played a lot of games. Nothing thrilling. I've switched to Vegetarian for the time being so as not to have issues with eating out since I'm so low energy. Maybe I just need to set my mind to something.

I think I'll try to resume my taper tomorrow. I'll cut off .25mg from my AM dose, leaving me at 1mg daily. After that, who knows. Hoping this less is more thing everyone talks about will kick in. If not, oh well, I'm already suffering.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Sub4Sevenyrs » Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:25 am

Hey mare, that's the point when I jumped...between 1.5 and 1.0 mg. I couldn't take it any longer, it didn't get better for me ever. I barely even got to 1mg, I took it for maybe a week. I'm not saying to jump, but start considering it. Take it slow, try to keep tapering down down down but if it doesn't get better, what really are the alternatives? It only takes a week to really start feeling much better. The taper is worse than the jump, believe me and ask Diet Doc who just went through it. Embrace the suck, for it is temporary. Would you trade 3 really bad days for years of good ones? Start thinking about it and wait for the warm weather which always seems to help these things one way or another.

I woke up today at 3am, did some exercise, made some breakfast and here I sit with a smoke and a coffee scouring indeed for a job at 8am. I would die for a job to go to. But I've never felt so great in my life and never had so much ability to function. At our age, there's no substitute. Enjoy your body, mind and life while it still has youth on its side. It'll be the best decision of your life and you'll thank yourself everyday, good or bad. Remember that light at the end of the tunnel.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Rascal123 » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:28 pm

Hiya Mare, we haven't spoken and just reading your thread. Another inspirational individual! smiles humbly.

Keep at it girl you well do it! easy to say I know I'm not down this far yet but fight the fight you've come so far.

It is a creepy drug, Big pharma! I've done most drugs and this is most certainly one I don't want controlling my life!

It's extreme, overkill, far too strong and on we go. We know this.

I hear you sports sevens I'm 43 now so not the adrenaline junkie I was. still have ago lol

"Start with baseball (centerfield), football (running back) then hockey (defense). I used to love flying around at 25 mph, getting low and smashing someone on open ice. I'm not a big guy but I was solid so that's really why it was so much fun, I could use my speed to get momentum and BOOOOM, you can feel every cell in your body stretching as it braces for the impact then recoiling yet no pain at all, just like an explosion."

I loved any sport something risky, fast like motocross, 5 a side football, squash,canyoning, skiing. downhill mountain biking, I miss it all as I don't get the buzz from them I used too :( but I will again, old or not!
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Subverted DietDoc » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:51 pm

Dear Reileen Kawahara-San,

Ditto on everything S7 wrote. There’s only one reason I was both on sub so long and tapered so long, age. I think this site should do some charts, one would be sub WD tolerance/jump dose verses age. It would be a smooth curve plotting the two and show an inverse relationship between age and jump tolerance. Put more simply, the younger you are the easier it is and the more you can handle and the faster you recover, all those things deteriorate as age progresses. But we older people got lots of cool stuff, but like the Meyer Lansky character said in The Godfather, “I’d give a million dollars just to take a normal piss again” hahaha. Point is, you’re a kid, kid. And you can take a punch much better than me or Cat or Anna...but not Cheeps, that bitch punches buses.

My taper suuuuucccccckkkkkeeed. If I was 25 years old I would have jumped at a milligram without question. I’m not saying to do that, what I am saying is you’ve been exposed to a lot of older people’s experiences dealing with getting off sub. I’ll bet you if you were in a room with a bunch of 20-somethings discussing everyone’s experiences getting off sub the conversation would be quite different. Just the fact you’re bored and wish you had more work is highly telling. Most, not all maybe, but most older people would rather not have/need to work toward during a taper.

I guess what I’m saying is don’t be afraid. I am probably one of the worst fatalists on this site. Do not take my thread seriously. I’m a drama queen. I was always writing how this taper thing was the end of the planet. Did it have moments that sucked ass, yes, yes it did. But it was so unnecessary to be so protracted. Your youth is an asset that cannot be overstated. Keep up the fight.

When you’re ready, take the punch. It won’t be as bad as you think.

Your Brother,

Takeshi Kovacs

(For anyone that might be wondering what the hell is going on with those names...Google Altered Carbon).
Last edited by Subverted DietDoc on Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I have two wolves fighting in my heart. One wolf is a vengeful, angry one. The other wolf is a loving, compassionate one. Which wolf will win the fight in my heart? The one I feed.

Buprenorphine: 10 years @ 16 mg/d ave. - Jumped Off February 5, 2018 @ 0.09mg
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby CatsMeow » Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:21 pm

This is so true Doc. Tapering/jumping off of sub is so different for a 20 something vs many of us on the boards now around 45 to 60+. There is no doubt that the body can heal faster when it's younger. I didn't even find pills until I was in my 50's. Things start to go wrong with the body in the 50's it seems to me. That's how I got hooked. My doctor just said, here, take these, and I did.

Mare, I just hope that you can find a way to stay a bit busier. Have you thought again about finding a temp place to practice your massage? It appears your current job is slowing down for you. Too much time on your hands can be difficult. I am actually glad that I have a job to keep me busy. Unfortunately it also comes with quite a bit of stress and that's not good.

I usually press people to go slow, but you're young and will be better equipped to jump. But you've got to find a way to tell Freddy to fuck off too. Have you read around in the Staying Clean section? Might be a good time to get that started.

Hope you're feeling well today!
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby cheeps » Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:18 pm

Mare, here is another taper plan, baciscally what SVDD is saying but with the numbers in it.

This one is fifteen percent drops

1.25 for ten days
1.10 for ten days
.94 for ten days
.80 for ten days
.68 for ten days
.56 for ten days and so on....

This one is 20 percent

1.25 for ten days
1.0 for ten days
.80 for ten days
.65 for ten days
.53 for ten days
.42 for ten days
.34 for ten days
.27 for ten days
.23 for ten days
.18 for ten days
.14 for ten days.
Jump

I believe it is time to go liquid so whatever you decide....you can get precisely what you want. If you switch now, you get used to any differences before you would really notice.

So....just go to liquid and then revisit these plans. You can do what you want to do....just move forward.

Love you sweetie...just push yourself a little.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Mare » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:20 pm

Thanks Cheeps. I'll give it a shot. I'm going for the 20% drops for now. Today is day 1 of .5mg twice daily. I think liquid will help. I'm starting to think my cutting the strips so small was leading to imprecise dosing.. and if just one .5mg strip is a little too big that could make it .6 and that means all the other pieces are missing that sliver. Maybe that was messing me up, the little additional slivers and subsequent missing slivers. I'll try it tonight. I'll need to go get one of those mini shot bottles of vodka. Yuck.

Cat: because I don't drive and the bay area is huge, it would be hard for me to freelance in massage. Rooms are expensive to rent and business isn't a sure thing, plus I'd have to pay for the Uber to and from. Same for in home massage. I just don't see it working right now. But I'd like to get even one or two days a week at a massage clinic. I'll see how I deal with this new drop.

Thank you SDD and S4S. And welcome Rascal! Thank you for taking the time to read this.

In other news, my one great love just showed up out of nowhere. He's the one that I thought I'd be an old woman having lived a full life with my one biggest regret being not having lived it with him. He says he's sorry for leaving and all the amazing romantic ridiculous things a person says. He said it all. He wants to come back to California and be with me. It's freaking me out. I don't know how to feel or how to react. He's the one person I've connected with wholly on a physical, emotional, mental, and spiritual level. Its made me very sad and very happy at the same time. I miss him. But it's hard to differentiate what's real and what's not in this situation. It's been 4 years and I've loved him this whole time, but I don't know if he's everything I've built him up to be.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby cheeps » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:40 pm

Oh mare...this is such bad timing. If he truly loves you.....there should be total honesty...and he should give you time to get off this shit, honor your wishes to MAKE HIM WAIT.....like a year. You have a BF now and the sub monkey too.


Jesus....this is such a bad time for you to make any decisions and EVEN after a jump I tell peeps....no major decisions for six months.

Wow....Mare, this is really horrible in a way. What is your gut telling you? pm me if you want to.
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Sub4Sevenyrs » Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:16 am

Cheeps, what kind advice is that? Make him wait a year? Thats crazy-talk. I've heard all about the Bruno Mars tickets, I bought a house 2 months after my jump, was a great choice.

Mare, if you've been thinking about someone for 4 years, do you really need advice? Unless you want to go another 40, might as well found out where it goes...
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Re: Mare counts down from 8

Postby Dcleanist » Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:42 am

Mare

I would say be honest/true and go with your heart and you will never fail, but the bottom line is your health. Facts are your a young smart attractive women. When your ready you will find multiple compatible capabilities. No end to the levels of desire. Only patience and virtues.

Ween at the pace of your body. Go as low as you can and jump. Congrats on your success so far. Peace
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