ratch wrote:Now take a drug like buprenorphine (Sub) or methadone, these drugs have ridiculously long 1/2 lives, 34+ hours. So not only is the dose you just took saturating the brain for the next 34 hours, but so is the doses you took for the past week. Basically you are getting a "steady high" and the brain has no way to create a point of reference on how you are supposed to feel without opioids. (almost never slight wd's, mental stuff perhaps, but actual wd's almost never) Not only does the brain lose its way back to normalcy so to speak, but the search for normalcy, the brain firing of signals to feel good again is almost non existent... no reason with drugs that are by design made to keep you high "all the time".. So not only does the brain have no point of reference as to what "normal" without opioids feels like, but sparking up the endocrine gland/pituitary to produce the signals/proteins needed to feel good again is fucking rusty with sub or methadone...with SAO's it fires everyday!!!
ratch wrote:Now I just want to be clear. At the 6mos to 1 year mark we feel mostly normal... BUT many of us still have energy/motivation issues where we need an extra "push" to get into gear...best described as the "bump on a log phase", its at this point where it gets impossible to measure progress. Its at this point that our brain needs to find its "new normal" and just get used to what normal life feels like without being high everyday is. I always say shoot for a year, because if we go on vacation or are preoccupied with something that keeps us busy..we don't think about it or even notice that we still feel "off" a year or even two after jumping. Its not that we are still in PAWS, but we are still getting adjusted to our new skin.
Reality check here...even regular people dont wake up with sunshine shooting out their ass and the desire to climb Mount Everest every morning...That feeling is reserved for people that are high every fucking day... and we all already know where that landed us. Its a false bravado crock-of-shit smokescreen that comes with a heavy price monetarily, mentally, and physically. So we need to find a new fucking normal and learn to accept the way we feel. I don't want to scare anyone, but it took me almost 3 years to plant that flag and claim "I am finally healed" ... I still need to drink more coffee, and I also cant do the tasks I once did, and if I really sit and think about it I can drive myself insane wondering if the sub actually damaged my brain.
But I also do the math... I started daily opioids in the early 90's, Sub in 1998, and I jumped in 2005... So I really haven't felt straight or perfect in 20 +years...when I was around 25 years OLD!!!! How the fuck am I ever supposed to gauge what is "perfect" for a 25 year compared to now being a 45 year old? And YES I know the question you are all asking yourselves right now. I did "try" opioids in 2007 for 11 days total, spaced out over 3 or 4 months (I was scared to get re-addicted so I spaced my little anti-PAWS "experiment" out intentionally) and not only did they NOT make me feel like that 25 year old again, or even better, I actually felt wonky and nodding out from trying so hard to feel good again. There was no instant fix, no magic reset button.. I was 20 fucking years older and I have to fucking accept it.
For all you sub suckers reading this, you better think long and hard about delaying the inevitable because I doubt many of us here jumped because sub made us feel "perfect" or "normal" forever. Nor did it continue to be effective forever. Because I have said this many times before, if the sub continued to work for me I would have never quit. And if I knew then what I know now, I would have quit years earlier when I was younger, and grew into this older body naturally. The longer you stay on, the longer you are fucking yourself..and not in a good way! You are theoretically Cryopreserving your brain's memory of youth and thawing it out into an older body. I guess its more of a dilemma than a medical condition. I guess you can call me some crazy "anti-sub" fucker that has nothing better to do with his time than rant about how evil and horrible sub is for shits-and-giggles. And I am sure there are also an unfortunate few of you that read the exact opposite on Suboxone.com or suboxtalkzone and still take their bullshit as gospel, and you still believe that you can stay on sub forever or jump off without batting an eye.. Well I may be just one crazy over-opinionated mother fucker who has a potty mouth and a individual sub "horror story" to tell, but how do you explain the 100's of identical stories from all my other members and other websites, and how we all seem to have the exact same problems and symptoms months, even years post sub?
For all you newcomers... If you think I am some anti-drug lunatic or some AA/NA program person I suggest you sit down, have a beer or smoke a joint and do a little more reading because that couldn't be further from the truth. And if you think I am taking my "12th step" by operating this site and you are a cute female please by all means come join me for a "13th step" and have a beer with me. Because if anyone familiar with the "Big Book" or the "basic text" knows, I just committed sacrilege typing the last paragraph. I am just a guy that thinks SUB SUCKS and I want to live life on my terms.. and FYI I haven't smoked pot in 25 years and I only drink once or twice a year if the occasion arises, nothing else.
Sub zero wrote:I think Sub ruined my ability to feel any sort of strong emotion or reaction. Just the other day I stunbled across some reaction videos on Youtube - vids of peoples faces as they watched "2 girls 1 cup"...well, I decided to check out the video myself and I just sat through it like I was watching an infomercial. Same happened for the "japanese fish ass" video. Neither phased me in any way. Other people get grossed out...yet I'm just like duuh. I blame it on the Sub.
nootlsjr wrote:Sub zero wrote:I think Sub ruined my ability to feel any sort of strong emotion or reaction. Just the other day I stunbled across some reaction videos on Youtube - vids of peoples faces as they watched "2 girls 1 cup"...well, I decided to check out the video myself and I just sat through it like I was watching an infomercial. Same happened for the "japanese fish ass" video. Neither phased me in any way. Other people get grossed out...yet I'm just like duuh. I blame it on the Sub.
subzero, i looked up to you on my early jumps and appreaciate your strenth/determination.
may i suggest a spark of enthuseasm, like bungy jumping or sky diving. it might spark some connections that are confused or disconnected. i like fast bikes because they scare the shit out of me. it causes the brain to be in a semi shock phase and maybe helps awarness. try something exstreme to kick start that brain of yours.
eitherway, i give you the utmost respect, because i know how it feels just to be ok, but it didnt last for me. sorry your having such a hard time healing and reassemblying natural contributes.[wether its mental,physicle, or emotional].
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