sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Justjules13 » Mon Jun 04, 2012 9:54 am

Hi ELE,
I really liked your post. I think your honesty about knowing that it's really "not THAT bad" will push you past the pains and anxiety that make people slip. Ive slipped and it's always because of a tooth ache or being tired....stupid stuff that's just part of everyday life. Your attitude is positive and I'm sure your going to do well. After being on such a low dose for so long, I bet your past the worst of the physical WD....after that it's just the lack of motivation thats tedious, but you seem to be really AWARE and know this is just a phase that will pass. It's hard to know that when your in the mist of it, for me...
Jules
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ratch » Mon Jun 04, 2012 11:22 am

Ele,
Just wanted to say your experience is the exception rather than than the rule. I know dozens if not hundreds of members that tapered down to .25 for months, Some even lower. And still experienced weeks of discomfort and months of PAWS. 'I got lucky" would be a better title for your thread. it does happen, I personally know 3 people that jumped without too much fanfare either, and a dozen more on the site that walked away after a week singing and dancing (kind of). Can you point out some nightmare/horror stories for me? i seem to always have a hard time finding them?

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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ELE » Mon Jun 04, 2012 12:13 pm

I'm really glad that some found my post useful, and i appreciate all the responses. Ratch- perhaps you have a valid point... The title of my thread is probably responsible for some of the responses I got. As far as horror stories go, there are plenty. Just above someone wrote about trouble holding a fork on day 8.. That sounds horrible to me. Anyway, I completely embrace the concept that each person is different, and experiences vary. I'm willing to except that my story isn't the rule. I would just encourage ppl to remember though that you won't know how you'll feel until you try missing some doses... Then I it's too bad, you can dose. Just try going a few days.

Thanks.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby doperdog » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:57 pm

Hi Ele,
Welcome to SubSux. I'm curious about your age, since it seems younger people have an easier time than older people getting off sub.
“Just cause you got the monkey off your back doesn't mean the circus has left town.” - George Carlin
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ELE » Mon Jun 04, 2012 2:09 pm

Thanks for the welcome. 26 yrs old.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby hope101 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 2:10 am

ELE wrote: Anyway, I completely embrace the concept that each person is different, and experiences vary. I'm willing to except that my story isn't the rule.



ELE...I really liked that quote in one of your recent posts. Like you I appreciate that not everyone has had an easy ride. However why do some people feel the need to post that you are being derogatory to those that have had a 'bad' time. You are only writing your experience,as is everyone, and in no way are you saying that you are 'better than' or others are 'less than'.

I for one am TRULY grateful that you posted your experience as I was beginning to think this was going to be awful and I myself am not finding it too bad , though admittedly I still have my final jump to do. However I am going to do my best to remain positive and too just see what happens instead of worrying about it as I had been after reading all the 'horror' stories.

We are all different in what we are able to tolerate, what our pain levels are etc. So pleased that you managed a 50mile bike ride so quickly as I run and go to the gym and was beginning to think I wouldn't be able to manage these...all I can do is try! :)

Thanks again Ele and keep up the good work, you're doing fantastic ;)
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Justjules13 » Tue Jun 05, 2012 6:37 am

Maybe people find the fact that ELE got off relatively easily as almost unbelievable...considering they had such a hard time. My experience here is that WDs are as individualized as people...some get off fairly easy and some have a terrible time. I would put myself somewhere in the middle. The physical was fairly eventful free, but the mental drove me back to opiates. I've noticed that with some,the more positive and willing a person is to except personal responcabilty for their addiction, the easier the whole process seems to be.
Congrats on your freedom ELE!
Jules
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward.
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Suboxone-slow taper to zero, very minimal WD (jump date 12/9/14)
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby CTCheryl » Tue Jun 05, 2012 7:28 am

I think it's all hell, it's just the degree of hell you go through. For me, it was the length of time it took for me to call a day normal.

I think people feel safe posting their true sub detoxes here and it's all relative as to horror.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby gillabug » Tue Jun 05, 2012 8:33 pm

Justjules13 wrote:Maybe people find the fact that ELE got off relatively easily as almost unbelievable...considering they had such a hard time. My experience here is that WDs are as individualized as people...some get off fairly easy and some have a terrible time. I would put myself somewhere in the middle. The physical was fairly eventful free, but the mental drove me back to opiates. I've noticed that with some,the more positive and willing a person is to except personal responcabilty for their addiction, the easier the whole process seems to be.
Congrats on your freedom ELE!
Jules


Same with me.. More than once.

Congrats ELE.. Your age is def. to your advantage hon..
Never make anyone a priority when all you are to them is an option...

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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ItsintheMail » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:32 am

Nice Long and Hard wean down....That is the way to do it. Congrats on finally giving it up. I can feel too that the people who have a seriously hard time, are those who dont wean properly IMO. I have gone from 16mg daily to 1 mg daily....I have had a few rough days in between...But so far this hasnt even come close to any other detox I have had. H, Methadone, OxyContin....etc. I believe your way is the correct way to go about it to achieve as few detox probs as possible. I plan on going to .5/.25......I was one of those people who was "on the fence" Some shit that I read here had me scared to fucking death! I really feel like this is very doable. Awesome Job!
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Sub zero » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:32 pm

Whether or not ELE intended it...the implication of the OP was that Suboxone isn't so bad as the rest of you believe. As a couple of posters stated above everybody is different and experiences Sub WD differently. That said, the fact that ELE got off so easy shouldn't be interpreted as an endorsement for Suboxone. Like Ratch said above, ELE's experience is highly atypical...the majority of people who have been on Suboxone are going to have a rough time getting off of it. Hence the very reason for this forums existence...we were all told Suboxone had no withdrawal, or only "minimal" withdrawal...we weren't told that this "milder" withdrawal would last a month or more and would be followed by PAWS. Despite what ELE experienced....Sub still SUCKS.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ELE » Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:47 pm

Here we go again…..


NOBODY SAID SUB DOESN"T SUCK. The only one making implications, with INTENTIONS is you.

Let's summarize… If I gave a handful of people.. lets see, how did you phrase it…. " FALSE HOPE" The VERY worst thing possible is that they would have horrible withdrawal symtoms, and hop back onto sub, unable to kick it as easily as I could.

Not every person on this forum is here b/c they know EXACTLY what sub withdrawals are like. I would argue that a lot of people are just scared, anxious, and are filled with misinformation. My post was MY experience. Anyone who read the post can also read other threads/books/websites and come to their own conclusion based on what they've read. Its called research.

I hate to have threads turn into this, but Dang… you made your point… I'm not here to "endorse suboxone" and as far as I can tell, you're the only one who read it that way… so I'm not sure who your warning is directed at.


update: Today Is day 13. Most of physical symtoms seem to have subsided. I can relate when ppl mention they are waiting to "feel normal", esp b/c this is the longest period of time I've gone without an opiate since I was 20. It feels weird to say that.. but essentially I have never experienced two solid weeks of adult life wihout drugs.

The best part for me so far has been being able to look my co-workers, my boss, and new people directly in the eye, and not worry if they can tell my pupils are smaller than average, or if they can detect that im not 100 percent sober minded. I feel like humans have an extremely intuitive 6th sense for when someone is medicated.

Ive noticed an ability to properly regulate my temperature. I used to sweat way more than normal, always shedding a sweatshirt even when others didn't need to. Today I worked in 3 layers all day, and was completely comfortable.

This morning, I had a deep yawn before work, and for a second I thought " oh crap, I need to take my sub". Yawning used to be a pretty big cue for me. I shut the thought down right away, but I think its a prime example of when ppl describe having to re-learn how to live without. I was simply just tired… normal person tired… hah not dope sick.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Sub zero » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:53 am

:deadhorse: :gaah:
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby ELE » Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:18 am

My sentiments exactly.
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby emily » Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:30 am

ELE
I think your post was exactly what was needed to balance the horror of most people w/d's on this site. Many of us are much older than you..like twice your age & it definitely is harder to change Anything as you get older..we are more "set in our ways" & have age related aches & pains.
NEVER ONCE did i think you were an advocate for sub. I don't know why some people can't just accept that this was your experience, period!
I also know 2 people who have walked away as you have after properly tapering with their doctors help, but...they were also you age.
Please keep posting & updating us, it's important for people to have hope. :D
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Sub zero » Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:50 am

ELE wrote:My sentiments exactly.


Hey we finally agree on something :banana: :cheers2:
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby Justjules13 » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:08 am

ELE, Congrats on your clean time....I hope you continue to report your experience daily...it's great to hear ALL ranges of WDs from Sub..I think a lot of people report that the WD was less severe than they expected. Days 13-20 can be tough for some, hope you fly thru with no real drama.
Again....Congrats!!!!
Jules
Even if you fall on your face, you're still moving forward.
Victor Kiam
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Methadone maintenance- 1999-May 23,2011 (140mg, tapering to 10 mg)
Suboxone-slow taper to zero, very minimal WD (jump date 12/9/14)
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby nootlsjr » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:58 pm

i would be zombified if not for my harsh wd's. maybe we get what we need, maybe if its good for you, its good for me, and im good. maybe sub gives some people super powers. you dont know till you try.lol. just kidding, dont hang up, stay online.lol. just kidding, right on brother man, welcome to the otherside. i dont care how you got here, as long as your here.

for people who say there scared to jump, are you scared of life or death. this should be balanced healthilly to your personal standerds/character, but dont fear life. if anything get clean and fear death. then the question is do you want to live or do you not give a shit about yourself, and its the drugs causing this depresion. its a mindfuck you must rectify to find peace/stability.
Y ask Y,Y. Y is Y.....
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby 620tcat » Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:36 am

ELE cool name , IMO a positive attitude goes a long way. I had to just get mean with it and kick myself in the ass when things were rough. I wanted off and I stayed off over two years. I switched from sub to norco just because the sub gave me extreme headaches and depression after being on it a few years. Regardless no matter what we come up against in life there are two ways of dealing with it. People sometimes doubt you in whatever it is you are trying to accomplish but it is your choice whether to listen to negative stuff or just ignore it and kick ass. I wish you well. I have been around here a long time and I really didn't mean that specifically about SZ or anyone else here. More generally speaking. I know several people that have gotten off sub with not too bad of problems but just know a lot more that had really long wd. Sometimes the former trolls make us question people's sincerity is all. Not cool when you aren't the troll.

Disclaimer ~ I'm back on oxy , started with surgery and I am taking it now longer than I should have , it was my choice and soon I will have to live with it. and detox. I can't wait. :| I'm really one to be dishing out advice at this point. :punchballs:
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Re: sub withdrawals, what sub withdrawals???

Postby subster58 » Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:39 am

ELE, thanks for your positive post and out come off subs, congrats. Whatever you feel or do is your experience and I respect it. Good for you at your young age of changing your life to make it better.
Love and Peace
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