Suboxone withdrawal timeline and PAWS timeframe

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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby aliciakay » Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:39 am

:rofl: lexy......
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby mynameisDAN82 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:08 pm

Great info here, I've read through it a few times. So much to take in!

Paws... I think id trade straight up, 1 extra month of physical wds for 3 months free of paws.. atleast with the physical wds I know what the fuck is going on! constant chills, fuck it, get a blanket. Shits, screw it eat some immodium. Days without sleep, more time to masterbate. Feeling like total shit, yea no shit dumb ass your in withdrawl!

Paws on the other hand... very sneaky.. you sleep but only in shifts of about an hour at a time. It makes you think if this is how sleep is? Or maybe its your bed that sucks.. or maybe I need new pillows.. depression, maybe I'm depressed or maybe this is just life.. why do I wake up some days and just hate everything but other days wake up and hate nothing? Some days I can't even answer a text message while other days all I want to do is talk! Am I crazy or anti social or maybe just bipolar.. some days I have all the answers but some days I have anything but answers. Like someone flips a switch in my brain, answers ON/answers OFF, wtf! Don't even talk to me with any kind of emotional concern of your own because I just freeze up! Ill listen to 10 songs on my mp3 player, tear up 4 songs, get pumped up 4 songss and zone out 2 songs. Usually normal except I have my mp3 player on repeat and its the same fucking song lol.

So.. fuck paws! Atleast I think its paws.. or maybe I'm crazy.. lol, see what I mean?

Overall I'm good though!
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Justjules13 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:03 pm

Lol...it's PAWS Dan! Your so right about the physical WD being "easier". I was focused on that..I hurt, but after about three weeks, it drifted into this weird head trip. I was panicky, paronid and depressed...I would trade that for the acute WD too.
I'm no doctor...but I think your going to be ok! My prescription? Funny movie and more masterbation... :boobshake: :banana:
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby True85 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:06 am

How do you know that adding meds will only prolong withdrawal. My MD says it will help the process. Maybe you should give some proof instead of shouting out these random facts you have in your head. I feel better since I have been on anti depressant. I dont see how it can hurt. I think it only helps. Im gonna go with the guy who studied neurology for 4+ years.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby mynameisDAN82 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:52 am

I understand the point made by owen, not saying its fact but I see what he is trying to say. Introducing an outside chemical as an antidepressant can slow down the natural healing process of the brain itself. Its again getting chemical help and may begin to get "lazy"... with that said, fuck it, if your feeling better when taking an antidepressant that's great cause paws fucking sucks! Its better to feel compfortable when healing if possible.

I'm just taking the vitiman and water route, for many reasons. One reason being I hate fucking doctors with a passion lol. St. Johns wart seems to do something, or maybe not, can't hurt though!
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby True85 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:59 pm

Yeah Dan and Owen. I see where yall are coming from, but to me why dont it makes sense if an antidepressant helps those neurotransmitters go the right way. Thats how the doctor explained it to me. He said that your brain has been hard wired over the years for drug use. I need to change my way of thinking he said and medicine will help make this happen. He said he wants to start weaning me off the lexapro in a few months. Im only on 10 mgs. Best of luck to everyone was not trying to come off like a prick.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Nopiods » Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:29 pm

Not saying your right or wrong True, but most of us were prescribed suboxone by a Dr, most promised little to no withdrawals. They were wrong about that, I'm sure they could easily be just as wrong with antidepressants. The brain is extremely complex, 4 years of neurology means absolutely nothing. I, for one, will never trust a Dr when it comes to my brain. I took very little suboxone for a fairly brief period, here I am 42 days later and still paying the price. Had I used a dr, my sub use would have been longer and stronger, you can guarantee that.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Owen » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:00 pm

I agree doctors do not know anything unless they themselves have taken sub, anti-depressants, or whatever, weaned off and stayed clean for 6 monthe or so...

Anti-depressants were made for people who did not have opiate related depression, its totally different ball game.. From my own experience and from reading others adding these meds can stop the natural endorphins from producing then when you have to get off an AD you have to go through PAWS/depression all over again, this is not Gospel but its experience from more then 1, when it comes to sub and ADs... I don't trust doctors when it comes to sub in conjunction with other meds.. I don't think anybody wants to be on ADs from sub related depression all their life, my GP said ADs focus more on dopamine and serontin, and in her experience sub affects the endorphins and not the former 2, don't quote me or her on that though...Meds may help in PAWS but we still have to go through them when we get off, this is a fact for suboxone users.. One is better off taking Iboga as it resets the brain in PAWS then ADs do, but even then you still have to feel reality to heal, longer one takes AD the harder it will be to accept reality once off..(My GP said this statment)..I trust her because she's anti-sub as you can get, and has dealt with sub patients, meds, ADs, PAWS etc so I rather trust her, people on sub and who have come off sub, people who have used ADs to come off sub and other factors, then some doctor with only 4 yeaes neuro experience whos never ever done sub or ADs or suffered through PAWS.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Owen » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:07 pm

Who knows it might not be the Lexapraro but time away from sub thats helping the PAWS...Could be just a coincidence,, I only say this because many other people who tried Lexaparo, Wellbutrin, Venafexaline etc during sub PAWS claimed it did not do much, if it did then it was only for 1-2 months or so, then mental foggyness again.. Or some claimed they had to get off ADs in order to heal from PAWS, but again each individual is different but when it comes to PAWS time is healer and not meds..

To be honest, I have done 2 flood Iboga treatments with tune ups/boosters and only then I felt half normal..I never said this because for 3 reasons, not to disspoint people, not to scare people nor to encourage people to do my way...When I did my first flood I felt okish for 2 months then PAWS creeped up, then I did another one with Root bark, then my depression started to go away little, thats WITH boosters too, I have tried ADs and though they made tiny bit of difference the PAWS still came back, and worse, so from my experience I would never go that route, unless I had chemical inbalance or clinical depression not related to sub...

Hell am still a young guy so if I can suffer PAWS after a fking long wean and SAO route, and 2 flood doses of Iboga and boosters, and relatively healthy and fit too then only people with super edoctrine systems can heal in 2 months from PAWS...Its take me around 2 years with 2 massive Ibogaine treatments, boosters, SAO route for 3 months, time and support to even feel semi normal...I honestly do not want to scare people but I must be honest about this, I did not say anything before because I did not want people to compare my experience to theirs, or get discouraged...

I did a slow wean, SAO route for 3 months, this in my opinion can extend depression, you have to take SAOs for at the minumum 6 months IMHO (if your a long term sub users)...I was on sub for almost 7 years but one thing I learnt is to never compare experiences, or rely on other peoples experience and recovery to determine your own, its not going to suffice, because 1 person can recover in 8 months yet another in 2 years...Thank goodness I was not in my 30s and over when I quit sub, I most probably would never have recovered in 2 years or still be in the thick of PAWS..Am still fking suffering some PAWS though..
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby True85 » Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:02 am

Yeah I understand what your saying. You may be right. It just may be time. I had a rough time today, but overall last month was better than this month. I am starting to feel better overall, but it is still rough. I will get to where I want to be. You been clean off subs for 2 years that is awesome Owen.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby mynameisDAN82 » Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:44 pm

I think your doing awesome tru! You keep fighting and that's What's important! I've got a friend who has been sober her entire life, she has a bad day once or twice a week. The sober world is a tough one for sure! We are stronger for seeing the other side though, that's what I believe anyways. Congrates on your sub free time tru! Keep kicking ass!

Dan
Sub free since 10-20-2012
Like most things in life the hardest part is starting, the easy part is wanting.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby HammyPammy » Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:30 am

Yay cheeps...you're awesome! Thanks for spending all that time to write this for everyone...something I was extremely curious about.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby nootlsjr » Wed May 01, 2013 2:19 pm

im going against my best judgment on posting this, but exspressing my veiws and exsperience might help.

the problem with taking a suplement is that you dont learn how to control your brain naturely. some may bennifit from this, but when you take the supplement away. you still have lessons to learn. it also shows fear of ones self. im scared of the wd proccess so you trust anyone with an exuse besides acceptance.

i cant say it wont work for you, but i knpw its not for me, then again i would pick coffee and weed over any other cumfort med.[thats me though].

the most important thing is to know what works for you and do your own personal homework including exsperience,strenths and weakness.

how could you trust a dr that never exsperienced what you are. [witch is diffderent for most]. trust your innerself. you know whats best, and anger is useally a sign of desceit. even if your desceiving yourself.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby subbywubs » Sat Jun 08, 2013 2:22 pm

Lots of great info here on this thread! thanks
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby subster58 » Sun Jun 09, 2013 7:21 pm

Hi everyone. Great post cheeps. I still have to read it as I think I'm going crazy again and again. Fucking sucks.
I was on antidepressants for over 8 year and my shrink told me it wouldn't help with the detox or PAWS, and it hasn't. I understand everyone is different and has different experiences. so what ever works go for it.
I believed I'd be better by now, and I am, but not where I want to stay. Suboxone fucks with the cells of the brain for some time. A lot of the time I still feel dead inside. Then better, then back in the hole. Pisses me off. Patience is the name of the game for me now. As others have posted I too would take a couple extra months of detox, than PAWS. Wishing you guys hope and strength in whatever your going through. It will get better.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby mynameisDAN82 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:52 pm

I don't think I've re-read anything more than this thread.. its amazing really, what sub actually does.. I wonder when the medical field will start to catch on.. its not right.. atleast be honest about it and explain how it could end up..
Sub free since 10-20-2012
Like most things in life the hardest part is starting, the easy part is wanting.
"Life gets hard.. Then it gets good, just like I always knew it would"
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby cheeps » Mon Jan 05, 2015 11:25 am

I'm bringing this up by member request.



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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby cheeps » Fri Mar 20, 2015 8:58 pm

:banana: :banana: :popcorn:
10 yrs on methadone
Meth free 10/08
Back surgery 5/12/14
Knee surgery 9/19/14
Oxy free 12/06/14
2017 taper in progress
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Sindysun » Sat Mar 21, 2015 8:34 am

So for anyone who has been clean for a while I have a question....

When did you feel dysphoric or depressed if you did? Do you still feel this way?

I'm just wondering if I'm not there yet because I feel happy. Depression has been my worst fear but hasn't happened.

Some days I feel tired, not the end of the world. I feel very minor skin tingling and anxiety on those days too. I know those symptoms are Post acute WD symptoms. It happened once this week and not very often before that.

I really feel basically good. I'm not looking for symptoms or dreading them but I also don't want to feel like I am ok then 2 months from now I don't know what is going on.
Tapered for 6 months down to .02. Sub free since 1/30/15 after 7 years.
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Re: Acute and More PAWS timeframe

Postby Sindysun » Sat Mar 28, 2015 9:54 am

Wow you guys that have been clean for a while suck for not responding to me in y time of need... :)

:) just wanted to bump this.
Tapered for 6 months down to .02. Sub free since 1/30/15 after 7 years.
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